Contemplating hitting the War Button with the Sales Team9463
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 WGAN StandardMember Las Vegas |
VTLV private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Got another call today about the Matterport Sales team trying to sell a camera to a new collaborator. Last week it was my client with the most spaces hosted. Quality control with these actions have been a bitch. I have had a big problem with Trust with this company preying on my clients pushing them to get their own camera and hosting platform. An actions that does nothing to help me out as a Matterport Service "Partner". May as well be a competitor who got their hands on my client list. "While this will benefit existing MSPs as long as grandfathered classic plans still exist -- it is difficult to continue to on faith that classic plans will not be taken away from us in the future." - @Metroplex360 I've lost all Trust in this company! Question is, do I shut up and begin to remove my Matterport references quietly or hit the war button and is getting kicked out of groups and become labeled as an adversary like @GeorgeK & 3D_Hoffa. Came across some Matterport Sign Up sheets to start with. |
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San Francisco |
Jwbuckl private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @VTLV I understand and hear the issue of trust right now with Matterport for some. One thing you can cross off your list, from all my double checking, has been the accusations of mining the product (like collaborators and agents) for camera leads. 100% of the time this ends up being that the collaborator or agent opted in on the Matterport mailing list at some point. Maybe they downloaded a webinar or white paper etc. This is a case where correlation does not equal causation. If you PM me the collaborator's email address, I would be willing to run the same history report for you to show you the same and ease the rumor mill. |
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GarySnyder private msg quote post Address this user | |
| That is absolutely false as it has happen to me and others I know. Why are you even in this group representing yourself as a MP Representative when you work for Elevar Pictures http://elevarpictures.com/about/ I've been involved with MP for going on 5 years and have spoken with several people who have lost clients due to MP contacting them. An early pet phrase of MP sales team to prospective customers was " the camera operation is so simple even a monkey can operate it" I feel everyone need to get a clear picture of the tactics MP uses and your are not telling it like it is. MP answers to their investors who want to see sales increase every quarter. This was a driving force in the major price increase for MP's to decrease their monthly burn rate. Everyone needs to understand that MP sales people all have targets to meet as do any sales person and no matter what you say they have access to public models like anyone else has. Any repetitive customer that request an MSP to produce VT's is a prime (hot lead) for the sales staff. Anyone who believes this is not the case are fooling themselves that is why many MSP now use false email addresses just to protect their customers from being contacted by MP sales staff. |
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 WGAN ForumFounder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @GarySnyder Matterport has engage @Jwbuckl at the C-suite level to engage with the WGAN Community. Highlights ✓ enabled the first-ever WGAN-TV Live at 5 Town Hall with Matterport executives (transcript) ✓ in discussions for Matterport executives to do 1-2 WGAN-TV Live at 5 shows monthly (including more Town Halls) ✓ engaging with the Community; including this and other WGAN discussions ✓ working on offering Matterport Pro2 Cameras to be added to the WGAN 3D/360º Camera Loaner Program ✓ facilitating other Members of the Matterport team to engage within the WGAN Forum ✓ facilitated Matterport joining WGAN as a Silver Member @Jwbuckl recognizes that there is a lot of history here. @Jwbuckl and I have done a number of Zoom video chats on the topic of trust/mistrust: including the Community's concern about Matterport Direct Sales poaching Matterport Service Provider clients. To the extent that we can cut him some slack and give him specific instances of poaching, that might go along way to see if it is possible for Matterport to earn back our trust. Obviously, with the recent Matterport New Pricing news, he has stepped into a challenging experience. On a personal note. I like him. He is a good listener. He's candid about the past. He's eager to move us forward. He has responded to me in a timely manner with every request for information that I have made. And, he is diligently working through every new post about poaching (and related trust issues). Surprisingly, or not surprisingly, his outreach to me was the fist meaningful interaction that I have had with Matterport in years. Matterport now recognizes that the 13,000 Visitors that we have to the Community monthly - from 125 countries - matters. And, based on my conversations with @Jwbuckl (and Matterport Chief Marketing Officer Chris Bell and Matterport Vice President of Product Management Damien Leostic) they "get it" that potential Matterport Camera buyers are researching Matterport – and other platforms and camera in the WGAN Forum. And, that to sell more cameras, they really need to win back the existing customers who - like me - have been cranky for sometime now. I would characterize my relationship with Matterport today as a period of Détente. @Jwbuckl has opened up the lines of communications with the WGAN Community. I am asking that you give him the benefit of the doubt that he is doing his best to restore trust (and that's not easy given the long history). I would suggest that you do a Zoom chat with him and talk about the poaching that you have experienced. And, see what his research shows for your specific Clients. Best, Dan |
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3D_Hoffa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Jwbuckl what office do you work out of? What is the data that is collected that you reference that clears Matterport of wrong doing? | ||
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3D_Hoffa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @VTLV I don't know if I'm 100% adversary. Let me be clear. I love Matterport the technology, I have a lot of resentment towards Matterport the company. I'm mad because I feel like the people in charge are underhanded and not trustworthy. Frankly, it's scary that they have so much power over how I make a living and I have absolutely no voice. So what are we to do? @DanSmigrod I'm not sure why I need to cut Jwbuckl any slack. He's a human being, I get that and sure there needs to be some respect there. And I'm glad you have been having private chats with him. You have long been fighting the fight for us. But... he has decided to represent a company that I feel has wronged a lot of people here. I'm not even sure who he is or what he does exactly at Matterport. Maybe he wants to chime in on the topic. But what I won't do is stop stirring up the pot. Talking, listening and posting is one thing, action is quite another. And nothing I have seen to this point says anything is going to change. They are just trying to calm the waters and lull us back to sleep as far as I'm concerned. |
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San Francisco |
Jwbuckl private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @GarySnyder @3D_Hoffa the thing about killing a conspiracy theory is that you can't. I have been offering transparency to the Matterport process and systems and all I get are questions about me personally. That is fine. I am a photography business owner myself in addition to a business consulting business owner in San Francisco. All of this is online in my WGAN profile. One of my clients is Matterport. My team works within the Marketing organization and is a strong advocate of the MSP program including the improvements to it currently in planning. My purposes here are to open up direct, open and HONEST lines of communication and to help with facts whenever fear, uncertainty or doubt creeps into the conversation - which is a lot lately. As always, I will do the best I can if you have any questions. PS. I may not be on the Forum each day due to competing time commitments. |
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WGAN Standard Member Las Vegas |
VTLV private msg quote post Address this user | |
@Jwbuckl - What the hell kind of "Partnership" are we in if my customer mentions they are loyal to working with me with no need to purchase a camera or their own servicing plan? I'm going to let the dust settle before I start prodding at the accountability of my clients for clues after telling the salespeople - NO! Playing detective between my clients who pay me for tours and the company I pay money to in order to host my tours for these same clients probably won't heal any wounds in the immediate future. These are people I need to raise prices on to absorb my upcoming cost of doing business when the "grandfathering" dies of old age. In future talks, I will continue to slide in the notion of entering contact information on Matterport pages will continue to lead them to pushy Matterport sales people contacting them for up-sells away from my services. A word of caution I have always prepped to those I include on contact info on tours for as well as those I invite to become a Collaborator or User. Pretty stupid that I should even mention this to clients because the sales team won't back off. No isn't in a salesman's vocabulary. -an issue clearly defined for years by @GarySnyder and the demand for higher shareholder returns. We understand tons of money has been dumped into this company and most shareholders want to see their dividends come back by the 5 year mark. That time has come, thus explaining another tryout for a CEO and original founders jumping ship. In a previous post, I had suggested looking at the whole "Partner" tag for Matterport Service Providers and possibly change the whole name away from "Partner" and work out a portal where MSP's can share information with our clients and you can focus on marketing to fresh leads that aren't already committed to an MSP. I hope that idea can go somewhere. If what your are saying is the issue, we need a portal that saves you marketing dollars not being wasted on our committed clients. yet having a direct portal for Customer Service for ourselves and our Clients/Collaborators. Quote: Originally Posted by Jwbuckl - I appreciate seeing some people such as yourself showing a face on WGA. Looking forward to tapping your brain in hopes that some of the ideas we throw at the wall here will stick. Hitting the off button and ignoring such a large community in the past was a childish move. A sign of weakness by those who didn't know how to handle the data that was being shared here. I hope your approach as a consultant who can show our thoughts as an important factor in the future can create some trust for the future. Terms such as Partner vs Provider along with other vocabulary may be a good area to start for ground floor understanding fellow Matterport Representatives, MSP's and the clients we all service. Quote: Originally Posted by 3D_Hoffa - We may as well all own Tivo bricks at the moment while we watch the cable companies offer DVR's. Certainly no track back to the old pricing model is being pitched, all in hopes we all get worn out and shut up. No acknowledgement of the Grandfathered in pricing platform with spelled out on paper about our overage pricing or lifetime of guarantees, No acknowledgment in any post about how Matterport can change terms of service because other companies like Google and Twitter have the same verbiage (ad based companies people pay for by giving up information), No explanation for why MSP's have to pay more money for the higher tier plans in the future than those with lower plans (doesn't the cost of doing business typically go down when larger quantities can be paid for?). @3D_Hoffa - I'm joining the other guys who will no longer push the Matterport product as a service we offer. I'll list Matterport on my services page, but I'm not going to advertise my work anytime in the near future. No social media, no sales, no publicity for the Matterport brand. I will quit wearing my "Look at your House in 3D" T-shirts. No respect given for the Allegiance my clients have to me, so Allegiance to Matterport. I wish I could give an economic sanction to Matterport, but I'm paid up for a few months. I got my observation towers watching out. I'm livid like Saddam Hussein in 1990 when Kuwait dropped oil prices and cost Iraq millions of dollars per day. In my case, I'm watching the price hike instead of drop or stay the same. Wish I could give one because NO means NO! |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @VTLV Thinking out-loud here ... The following is designed to have the fist question that a Matterport sales person asks a prospect is, "Are you presently using Matterport?" If the answer is "Yes" then the Matterport sales person is instructed to say, "That's great!" And, quickly end the communication. What if Matterport agreed to the following going forward ... 1. Matterport does not commission its sales people on selling a Camera to someone that is already using Matterport via a third-party (e.g. your client). 2. Matterport pays you a $500 for each of your clients that buys a Camera. While you lose the life-time value of a Client, you do get the $500 3. When Matterport pays out the $500, if a Matterport sales person received a commission for a camera sale, the commission would be removed and the sales person would be dinged $500 for selling a Camera to someone that was already using you. The exception would be if the Matterport sales person asked the prospect if they were presently using Matterport. (see next step) 4. All Matterport sales calls are recorded. If the sales person asked the prospect, "Are you using Matterport?" And the answer was "Yes" and they still sold them a Camera, they would forfeit their commission and be dinged the $500. If The answer was "No" - but they were - they would still forfeit their commission, but not be dinged the $500. 5. The sales person is now highly motivated not to poach because not only would they not receive a commission they would be penalized for knowingly poaching. (They would also be penalized if they failed to ask, "Are you presently using Matterport?" 6. If your Client buys a Matterport Camera, you complete a Matterport form requesting your $500. 7. Assuming that the Matterport sales people get a commission of around $500 per camera, this program does NOT cost Matterport anything more that what they are doing. Essentially, the commission just shifted to you instead of the Matterport Sales Person. Plus, penalties to Matterport sales people that knowingly sell a Matterport camera to someone already using Matterport - or failing to qualify them - will help stop the bad behavior. 8. While there are a lot of steps for the above, I actually view it as simple to implement. Matterport Sales people simply need to qualify a prospect - are you presently using Matterport - and if they are, there are consequences for selling them a Camera that is triggered by your request to get compensated for a client buying a Matterport camera. 9. Bonus. Imagine that your prospect/client takes you for a test drive - engaging you for one scan - and buys a Matterport Camera. You at least made money for the test drive and for the prospect buying a Matterport camera. (Matterport would then have a new channel for Camera sales. They could promote, test drive Matterport with a MSP. They then either continue with you as a Client; buy a Camera (and you get paid $500). Your thoughts? Anyone else want to weigh-in on this? Best, Dan |
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3D_Hoffa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Jwbuckl You didn't exactly give me transparency on my question. I was curious as to what data is collected that indisputably exonerates Matterport in Gary's, and many others, claims. You examined history? Is this history in a CRM? Do the sales agents document in the history that they found a lead in an MSP's account? I doubt it. And even if they did, would we be shown? I agree that most conspiracy theories cannot be stamped out but at this point, I'm going to take the word of the many vs. the word of the people that have already tried to pull one over on me. That's just how it is. If the data says it doesn't happen, then what is that data, how is it collected and how do you 100% draw a conclusion? I think it's a fair question. You're in San Francisco. How much interaction do you actually have with the Chicago sales team? Or any other area sales teams for Matterport? Are you just looking at raw data or do you actually know these people? I've worked with sales agents in Real Estate and they can be cutthroat, no matter what they need to do to make a sale and feed themselves. And yes, I am curious who you are personally. You seem to want us all to take you for your word. You are a "Matterport Representative" not listed on their site so I wondered if you could actually do anything with the feedback you have been getting. But as you stated, you are not an actual employee but a consultant to Matterport. In Marketing. Do you have some sort of direct connection/input to the board? And don't get me wrong. I do appreciate you trying to open the lines of communication. I just don't know how much you can be trusted. Or what good you can actually do. So I'm skeptical... So I have another question... Since you're a consultant, were you hired before or after they determined they were going to make this pricing change? |
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San Francisco |
Jwbuckl private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @3D_Hoffa I hardly believe I am discussing transparency and trust with an anonymous poster. That said... The CRM and Marketing Automation Systems (MAS) are separate. When a person inputs their credentials to Matterport to be on our mailing list, this does not trigger a sales call. The contact remains in our MAS system only. Sales calls are very expensive and we have many thousands of real qualified leads to process each quarter. Also, the last people we WANT to call are those that are customers of the network already (through MSPs). In order for a MAS contact to become a Marketing lead and drop over to the CRM as a Sales lead, lot's of interactions need to happen. The person would need to download a lot, have sales questions, watch webinars etc. Lot's of activities, not one or two. The Sales team does not have access to your model data. A collaborator may opt to be put on the mailing list, and may receive mailers from time to time if they do opt in, but will not receive a call unless they have done a lot to climb up the scoring system and turn into a sales lead in the system. That is their choice, not yours or ours. Some number of customers, in the end, will want to self-service and will seek that out. I have researched contacts that were supposedly solicited out of the system and have found that email tracing starting well before they sometimes become collaborators. Often time you find out that these contacts started learning about Matterport, then fill out a "Find a Photographer" lead form. If you have one that is particularly suspicious, let me know, and I will run a trace on it for the group, but in the end, if you don't trust me and you don't trust Matterport, then all of this writing above is truly a wasted effort on all our parts. No, I have nothing to do with pricing. |
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3D_Hoffa private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Jwbuckl Hahaha, I love the passive aggressiveness. Honestly, under different circumstances, we would probably get along great. Yep, I’m anonymous. I feel I must be at this point. So... is Jwbuckl your first or last name? How do you pronounce that? You mean it’s not really your name? I get it, it’s your entire name shortened but why are we going here? Come on, you’re better than me. Seems off topic and you really have a post with some good info. Vague, but good. Unfortunately, it won’t do much to crush the conspiracy theories which I think everyone would like to see crushed, but it can at least back up some of what you are saying. I don’t know how much people know about marketing automation software but books, seminars, conferences, training, etc… are dedicated to the topic and the supporting software. And I would be foolish to think it could be explained in a forum post, especially with my limited knowledge, but let’s go down the rabbit hole a bit. There are many companies that offer marketing automation. Adobe/Marketo, Salesforce Marketing Cloud/Pardot, Hubspot and many, many others. They all can work a little differently and have different capabilities, but at their core, they are pretty much the same. Please keep in mind, I do not know what Matterport’s set up is, but I can take an educated guess on how it would be set up. So, at this point, this is just speculation. So how do these systems work? You can think of the MAS as a layer that sits between a website (or group of sites) and the CRM (where salespeople will work out of to manage leads). A MAS can be used for many things including nurturing leads, lead scoring, lead attribution, personalization, lead capture, activity tracking, mass mail, etc… And even super creepy things like once they have your email, they can crawl social media sites and start building a profile of you in the system without you even knowing. Creepy, but cool. I’ve seen it. I’m not saying Matterport does this, but it’s possible. So Jwbuckl says they have to manage 1000’s of leads a month. Let’s just say it’s 2,000 leads a month. And now let’s say each salesperson can “effectively” manage 100 leads at a time. That’s calls, emails, and whatever else is in their follow up program. So, this is simple math, it would take 20 salespeople to “effectively” manage 2,000 leads every month in this scenario. So here is the problem from a Matterport perspective. They keep generating leads. A lot of these leads are crap tire kickers or not yet ready to buy. Matterport can’t keep hiring salespeople to manage all these leads, it’s too expensive and ineffective. That’s where MAS software comes in. The idea is that the software automates a lot of this work for the salespeople and helps them identify leads that are ready to buy. Thus, making them more efficient and giving them the ability to really focus on only good leads. And in the background, automated nurturing programs within the software attempt to turn the not so good leads into better leads, or flush them out of the system altogether before a salesperson wastes their time on them. So, they are still managing their 100 leads but they are more likely to convert because the MAS did its job. One main feature of this type of software is some form of lead scoring. Jwbuckl talks about leads moving through the system as “Marketing Leads” and “Sales Leads”. That’s part of what a MAS does, it systematically moves people through the sales funnel or lead lifecycle based on certain demographic or user behavior. Let me explain. Different companies will have different lead lifecycles and many companies can have multiple lead lifecycles to handle different types of customers. That’s way in the weeds but here is a basic lead lifecycle. All of us are trying to move people from left to right. They start as anonymous people and are pushed through the funnel or lifecycle until the buy the product which is ultimately our end goal. I could imagine Matterport’s is something like this. Anonymous >> Known >> Marketing Qualified >> Sales Qualified >> Buyer >> System Owner Anonymous – We don’t know who they are, but they visited our website. This is typically when MAS software will cookie the user’s browser and start populating the lead database with their anonymous web activity. What pages did they visit, how long were they on the site, etc… Known – The person has filled out a form on the website and now we have their contact information. We “know” them. And now all the information we were collecting in the background while they were anonymous is now attached to a name in the MAS system. Yeah haw, a lead but it’s too soon to start doing heavy sales and marketing to them. They are just feeling us out so let’s not be aggressive with a bunch to sales and marketing crap. We don’t want to scare them off. Marketing Qualified – So this is where lead scoring comes into play. Lead scoring basically attaches point values to certain activities or demographics. Filling out a form might be 1 point, attending a webinar might be 3 points, visiting the site 5 days in a row might be 5 points, their job title of “sales manager” might be worth 8 points. Whatever the lead scoring system is, it’s just collecting and adding points up. And once they hit a certain threshold, let’s say 50 points, well now they are “marketing qualified” and we’re going to start moving them to the next part of the funnel and start marketing to them. At this point, sales still do not know this person exists and we have not dumped them into the CRM system yet so they can work them. Sales Qualified – Ok, so we’ve been doing aggressive marketing and they are continuing to rack up lead score points and all signals say… This person is ready to buy! Now we dump them into the CRM and let the salespeople shoot the fish in the barrel so to speak. They are converting people into a buyer. Buyer – Ok, I’ve committed. I’m going to buy into this system despite all the warning signs I’ve seen. Matterport can stop the marketing and sales stuff. Now we are sending them stuff to get them excited about their shiny new camera and all the things they can do when it arrives. We are making them feel good about the purchase, so they don’t panic and return it before the 30 days is up. System Owner – I’m in. Occasional follow up, maybe send 2-3 leads a year if you’re an MSP. And we are done here. Where is my commission? So that’s MAS is in a nutshell. I promise there is A LOT more to it, but you get the gist. So how does this help Jwbuckl? I’m 100% sure he has the ability to search the history of a lead with a fairly good degree of accuracy. That’s part of what a MAS will do. You can give him a name or email and he can probably trace that person right back to the very beginning of when that lead was just an anonymous person visiting the website. So that’s another main feature of a MAS, lead attribution. Again, I do not know what Matterport uses but I’m sure the software notches how a person reached their site at first touch. Whether it was a Google search, ppc or social media effort, tradeshow or however they collected the lead. More on this later… I’m sure he can tell you exactly when a lead entered the system, what form they filled out, what pages they were on, and a ton of other things. See, the system needs to tell you what is effective and if you can’t give proper lead attribution, how do you know if your $50,000 ad spend worked? He can definitely tell you if a lead was a lead before you ever dreamt of making them a collaborator. Or created a tour for them. Or any other way YOU think you may have fed a lead to Matterport. It will most likely be right there in the lead’s history. It’s not 100%, but usually pretty good. And when he says the salespeople do not have access to your models, I 100% believe that as well. Why? Because they don’t need to have access to your models. That’s the good news for Jwbuckl. So here is where it starts to fall apart and fails to crush the conspiracy theories. Again, this is speculation based on my limited knowledge of MAS’s. Forms are a primary tool of lead capture for any MAS. Yes, there are other ways, but forms are a big one. The collaborator invite, the fields you fill out when you enter contact information for a tour, it’s all in form submissions that save the data to a database. This makes it very simple to pass that information into the MAS. They don’t even have to be directly connected to each other which makes it fairly simple to hide. I also find this line hard to believe. “Also, the last people we WANT to call are those that are customers of the network already (through MSPs)”. This makes no sense to me. I’m going to take off my MSP hat and put on my Matterport marketing hat here. Even though we all know it’s underhanded, follow me here… I have to assume that Matterport segments their leads in the MAS. At the most basic, basic, basic level, you will have people in two categories. Camera owner’s and non-camera owners. Again, my Matterport marketing hat is on.. Matterport Management – You cannot poach leads that are captured via collaborator or tour purchase. No way, no how! Matterport Salesperson - So you are telling me that if a lead is inserted into the MAS as a collaborator or tour purchaser, which is someone who is most likely to understand the camera and system, so much so that they are now a collaborator on someone else’s account, or they have shown interest in purchasing tours because an MSP put their contact information in a model.. AND I know they do not belong in the camera owner segment in the MAS… I can’t try to sell to them??? Come on. That can’t be. It’s just not logical. As underhanded as it is, those would be some of your best leads! Anyway. That was fun. For those that know how MAS’s work, I apologize. For those that don’t, hopefully you have a better understanding. |
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San Francisco |
Jwbuckl private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @3D_Hoffa "Matterport Salesperson - So you are telling me that if a lead is inserted into the MAS as a collaborator or tour purchaser, which is someone who is most likely to understand the camera and system, so much so that they are now a collaborator on someone else’s account, or they have shown interest in purchasing tours because an MSP put their contact information in a model.. AND I know they do not belong in the camera owner segment in the MAS… I can’t try to sell to them???" You are right that you can't try to sell to them, but here are the cleared up details: 1. If a collaborator inputs their data and clicks "yes, contact me with information" They are not a lead. They remain a contact in the MAS, do not connect with the CRM and the Salespeople never see the information. More stuff would need to happen. 2. Salespeople cannot log onto the Matterport Cloud and look up your collaborator information separately from this MAS/CRM process. Your information remains private. 3. Our best leads are photographers who want to build a franchise out of the Matterport solution. They not only buy the camera(s) but upload and share the most. There are definitely the collaborators who believe they can save a few bucks by becoming their own photographer, but they don't generally go on to grow large model collections comparatively. 4. To use private contact data in the model to sell from underneath a partner would be underhanded. This is one of the many reasons that the marketing/sales technology stack here doesn't support it. Don't forget we also have rules and regs around the world to comply with in handling this personal data. This is why I write with confidence that I can run a trace on any email in question to show where it came from and when and if it was ever touched by personnel. |
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3D_Hoffa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| 1. Right. You've already said that. Lead scoring. 2. Right. We've already established they have no need to. The contact information goes right into the MAS and eventually makes it to the CRM (if they score into it) so why would they need to login to our accounts to go get it? It's already in the system automatically. 3. I said they would be one of you best leads. But...ok. 4. a.Bah. I guess I would believe it if there wasn't a history. Maybe one day that trust will be built again but that isn't today. b. What, GDPR? What else does Matterport strictly adhere to? How about in the US? Or Asia? Or South America? Or Australia, or wherever else GDPR doesn't cover? *bonus response - I think I supported you in saying you could easily trace any lead in the system. Sigh... I think we've beat this dead horse and obviously no conclusion can be reached on either side. |
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3D_Hoffa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| This post is important and should not be buried *bump* | ||
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Changesin3d private msg quote post Address this user | |
@Jwbuckl and @3D_Hoffa Quote:Originally Posted by Jwbuckl If Mr. Jwbuckl wants to know why some people have elected to not announce who they are, he need do no more than go to the Matterport terms of use and look at section 9 "termination" Matterport can not expect anyone to believe they will not use this and put the MSPs business in peril. If this is not designed to silence the MSP why do you have it in the Terms of Use, Mr. JwBuckl? go ahead look at https://matterport.com/terms-of-use/ Mr. Jwbuckl I think you owe Mr. Hoffa an apology! |
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3D_Hoffa private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hahahaha, no apology required. He's doing the thing Matterport pays his consulting company to do and I'm trying to protect my butt and affect change. Only time will tell... |
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Changesin3d private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by 3D_Hoffa Now this is just me but I would not represent a company that believes it was fair to change a TOS at any time or use the threat of disconnecting a "partner" at their sole discretion and that is what is in the paperwork, right? |
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San Francisco |
Jwbuckl private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Changesin3d @3D_Hoffa Please. We know who you are and furthermore, these are fairly standard terms and conditions for agreements like these. Check out Salesforce's for instance. There is nothing sneaky in here. We would much rather harness this energy you have to help grow your photography businesses. The market is growing without you two! |
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Changesin3d private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Jwbuckl you are a classic... ignore answering anything of importance and infer you are smarter than you could possibly be. Let's get back to the FTC RULE for Business Opportunities. Why does Matterport not DISCLOSE? And why does Matterport threaten all of your clients in the TERMS of USE with "Termination" do you not encourage people to discuss issues in private? You want to do a live interview tell DAN to get some questions from the FIELD without saying who they are from. NO SOFTBALL.. lets get to the good stuff.. |
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| Post 20 • IP flag post | ||
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San Francisco |
Jwbuckl private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Changesin3d Hey GFK, these Forum threads are supposed to be people helping people. You are straight up trolling Matterport and now me, personally, which is not appreciated. For the sake of the readers trying to make sense of this, I will lay this out one last time the best I can. You are highly encouraged to seek the assistance of a personal attorney to help you through your questions. 1. I am not an attorney, nor a legal spokesperson for Matterport 2. Matterport does not sell franchise licenses nor does it charge entrance to the MSP program - the MSP program is a free and optional program for professional MP camera owners - camera owners do not need to join to be in the business of selling MP tours - free pre-qualified leads (by the very nature of being filtered through the "find the photographer" funnel)are part of the program. - the warranty for leads under which you agreed to join the program reads as follows: "7. No Warranty. THE PROGRAM IS PROVIDED ON AN “AS IS” AND “AS AVAILABLE” BASIS, WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, WHETHER WRITTEN OR ORAL, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED. MATTERPORT DISCLAIMS, ON BEHALF OF ITSELF AND ITS AFFILIATES AND LICENSORS, ALL IMPLIED WARRANTIES, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO ALL WARRANTIES OF TITLE, NON-INFRINGEMENT, MERCHANTABILITY AND FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. MATTERPORT DOES NOT REPRESENT OR WARRANT: (a) THAT THE PROGRAM WILL MEET YOUR NEEDS OR REQUIREMENTS; (b) THAT THE PROGRAM WILL INCREASE YOUR BUSINESS OR REVENUE; OR (c) THE NUMBER LEADS THAT THE PROGRAM WILL GENERATE FOR YOUR BUSINESS." 3. Matterport has not and does not threaten all of its clients with Termination less they speak in private about "issues". Matterport does reserve the right to terminate any of its customer relationships as is standard in the SaaS world. I have included a few below. EXAMPLE 1 SALESFORCE PARTNER AGREEMENT: "9.3. Termination for Convenience. Subject to Section 9.4 (Effect of Termination) below, SFDC may terminate this SPPA for convenience upon thirty (30) days’ written notice to Partner." EXAMPLE 2 GOOGLE PARTNER AGREEMENT: "Modifying and Terminating our Services ... Google may also stop providing Services to you, or add or create new limits to our Services at any time." EXAMPLE 3 GEOCV TERMS OF SERVICE: "ELIGIBILITY...We reserve the right, in our sole discretion, to refuse, suspend, or terminate access to the GeoCV Service to anyone for any reason or no reason." Hope that helped. |
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| Post 21 • IP flag post | ||
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Changesin3d private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Well @Jwbuckl why do you not go get an ATTORNEY'S opinion from the Matterport team.... you are really no more that a PR guy that is trying to make people love a system that they have major faults with. You play word games and use half truths. You should run for political office, just my opinion. You want to compare Matterport to GEOCV let's do that. Tell me where I am wrong, if I am, GEOCV will allow people to host their files and give them to them. You do not allow anyone to host any place they want. SO IF MATTERPORT discontinues service the MSP does not have an option, in fact in Terms of Use I think it says you have to erase all data. So they are not equal are they? You seem to want to point to someone else doing wrong as an excuse for you having the same ability. I really hope that MSPs file with the FTC and the equal of States Laws, like in that video that were mentioned here earlier, just to put this to the test. Why not run over to the legal team and find out if there was a mistake? Why is Matterport not a Business Opportunity? Dying to hear this. If you can not do that, I would think anyone reading this will realize that there may be some real substance to you being a Business Opportunity, right? Let's see if you respond to this. |
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| Post 22 • IP flag post | ||
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