Google Street View unbrands Client Tours5374
Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| I have been providing Google Street View tours for several years. Under the old program, a Google Trusted Photographer was allowed to attribute the tour to the business or anyone they chose. The new GSV program forced publishing my name on all of my tours (Chris Hickman), thus I was forced in response to change my primary Google Account's name to 'Metroplex 360' -- which is not something I ever wanted to do, but had to do. I'm not setting up a secondary account for publishing to GSV with -- that's just silly. -- This week, Google has retroactively removed ALL tour attribution and replaced it with the GTP's name (or in my case, 'Metroplex 360'). This has affected all of the tours that I have published on behalf of iGuide users, some Matterport Users (While MP2SV was available) and all of my own tours that I had whitelabelled for my clients. -- To illustrate this: https://goo.gl/maps/dQKNj6RFUXo (Sometimes WGA's streetview shortcode shows the 'See Outside' instead of the actual tour, so I've included a link) This tour previously said 'We Get Around Atlanta' and now says 'Metroplex 360'. -- First Google killed their free business view system that included automatic image linking using advanced algorithms. While only GTPs had access, this system was pretty amazing. Second, Google killed the 'See Inside' image, which was the #1 reason that clients wanted a Google Street View tour in the first place. And now, Google has killed off all white labelling that was done in the past - and that many sold tours were contingent on. -- What do you think of Google's decision? Are you excited about publishing to Street View? |
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JC3DCX private msg quote post Address this user | |
| oy vay, not good, | ||
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TrustedPhotoDC private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Chris @metroplex360, sadly you were not playing by Google's rules in the old moderator, as the instructions were specific as to how to attribute a virtual tour to the photographer or to the agency. Before Google stopped caring with Armstrong leading the 'save the world' call, if you published with the wrong attribution, it would have failed QA. So you really have no one but yourself to blame for this issue you are having. And having more than one publish to SV account isn't silly, but rather practical. For [redacted] sakes, I have like 4 or 5 of them. |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @TrustedPhotoDC I'm sorry, but I'm going to fully disagree with you here. Google provided the custom attribution with the intention that you would type in "Photographer" or "Photographer, Agency". If my complaint was that - "I was working for TrustedPhotoDC and I submitted tours as : Chris Hickman, TrustedPhotoDC.com' and now all my tours are showing up as 'FriendlySnuggleBug' (my Google Account name), it would be the exact same cause and effect. I believe that this feature was so that people did not have to manage 4-5 different Google accounts in order to publish GSV tours with different attributions. As far as I'm concerned, each of my clients hired me as their white labelled photographer, therefore, they were the photographer. |
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TrustedPhotoDC private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Sorry @metroplex there was no white label option(custom field) and your argument is without merit. It is easy to change your account name to one that replicates the former attribution if that is what you want displayed or you can change it. If you want the business name displayed transfer the SV photospheres(FYI this is not giving the copyright to the new account, only a license) and it will give a local SEO kick.  |
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 WGAN ForumFounder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
 Screen Grab: Where is says, Metroplex 360, it use to say, We Get Around Atlanta @Metroplex360 About: "Sometimes WGA's streetview shortcode shows the 'See Outside' instead of the actual tour, so I've included a link" We will get that fixed. I see that the We Get Around Network Forum embedded the wrong Google Street View tour. And, I see where it says Metroplex 360, when it previous said We Get Around Atlanta. (Screen grab above) Best, Dan |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @TrustedPhotoDC -- "Hi Street View | Trusted! Just a friendly reminder that it is very important to set your attribution in your Street View editor to correctly reflect the format listed in our Help Center. Tour attributions are used to track and attribute shoots to the correct photographer/agency for certification. To set your attribution, please go to the Street View Editor and click on "account" on the left hand side. You will then need to enter your attribution into the fields which should only include the information below: For Trusted Photographers: Photographer's name (make sure you enter your First and Last name), Photographer's business name For Trusted Agencies: Agency’s business name Thanks for your attention," ------------- Like I said, if I was hired by another agency and attributed a tour using Google's rules, I might use: Chris Hickman, We Get Around Atlanta If my personal Google Account was 'SmellyDinosaurFeet', the tour would now belong to a dinosaur with smelly feet. Not to mention that the tours will now link to my profile and anything that I've posted (perhaps pictures of my little stinky dinosaurs and family get togethers). Not cool. |
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TrustedPhotoDC private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @metroplex what you are forgetting is that ONLY certified TIPS and Agencies could publish. If you wanted to publish as We Get Around Atlanta, you would have published with their SV login and account. @dansmigrod was not, so you couldn't and would have to use your publishing login. This did not follow Google's requirement for attribution. I wrote about this issue in a thread last year. You are co-mingling two issues here - your original attribution and the Google Maps team migration to Local Guides which will bring the content into a user account. Might be new to you, but these issues have been actively discussed since April with various interaction from Google's different teams. What's up with you and smelly feet? |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @TrustedPhotoDC Not all of my points may be equally valid, however I do believe that the scenario wherein a trusted photographer's Google account name does not mirror their forward facing business name is highly problematic. In addition to posting on the behalf of others, I have also published tours on behalf of others who were Google trusted photographers / agencies. Those tours are now branded as me. I was never offered a login or account within their system nor was I aware that such an arrangement needed to be made. I do recognize that GBV had accounts for both agencies and photographers. I wonder how the migration of those tours has been handled. Additionally, where have these discussions been? I spend far too much time reading posts on the trusted forum (soon to be sunset) as well as the local guides forum. I have always felt that a great number of things were ambiguous and created with intentions but not enforced. I have never once seen any recommendation that all gsv work be done under a separate account to one's general Google account. Perhaps you and I may agree that Google might consider allowing local guides to setup a custom name for contributions in order to abstract business content from personal. I have transferred rights to clients in attempt to White label under the the new system, however my name remains under their name, which was not described by the process and is also unfavorable. |
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aarongeis private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hi Chris et al, I'm going to skip over historical issues and Google policy and get right to what I've found as the practical solution in the (almost) current environment (as of a few weeks ago at least). When I want to have a tour show an attribution other than my main business name I create a new G account for that purpose. I've created about 5 new accounts for various reasons, it's easy to do and I haven't had any problem with using the same recovery account and phone number for all of them. I use Dashlane to keep track of the various sign-ins and, so far, I've not encountered any downside to doing this. As a side note, you can also add something in the 'caption' field of the metadata (in LR) to make use of the second line of attribution. So I can have - first line - Such and Such Agency (user name in new account)- second line - photos by Aaron Geis (added as a caption). Hypothetically, once all of your old tours are migrated to your legacy G account that you used for SVT you could then transfer the tours to new accounts that have been set up to show the various attributions you may require. Caveat - While I've tested everything up to the final hypothetical it's been a few weeks ago now and everything seems to be in flux at the moment so no guarantees that it still works the same way as it was just recently. Best, Aaron |
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 WGAN ForumTech |
mikew private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by DanSmigrod Is this happening on ALL Streetview embeds or just this one? To embed the GSVs we are relying on Google to (1) give us info about the tour from the shortlink (e.g., latitude, longitude, etc.); and (2) correctly embed the tour using their own prescribed format (https://developers.google.com/maps/documentation/embed/guide#street_view_mode) Google Maps does not seem to "realize" that a tour is connected to the given lat/lng when we embed it but the shortlink itself works just fine. So that suggests there is an issue with the embed code that might be outside of our control. |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @aarongeis - I had no idea about the metadata for second line of attribution. Do you have an example to show? If this is true, I wonder if GoThru.co would be willing to integrate this. You must agree that the idea of creating multiple accounts to get around this 'problem' is quite silly and makes my original complaint seem valid - that the custom attribution field was an excellent way to do this. What company wants people running multiple accounts vs. simply filling in a wide open field at the time of submission? Quote: Originally Posted by aarongeis When you say 'transfer' - do you mean transfer the photo rights in the SV App? I've done that before to a G+ Business Account and it resulted in BOTH the business name and then my name below. As an added bonus, while my name remained on it, I had no editing rights afterwards. That would be ok with me if my name were off of it  Quote: Originally Posted by mikew I'm confused about this as someone posted a GSV Shortlink on Facebook that opened correctly on mobile in the SV App, but opened on the street for me when on the web. |
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aarongeis private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hi Chris, Looking at an example I guess I had it upside down; the caption sits above the attribution. I do agree that there must be a better way. I would absolutely love it if Google convened a Hang-Out with some of the more experienced pros and asked for guidance as to how to make the system work for end users, businesses, content creators and also achieve Google's goals of keeping Google at the top of the search game. But no sign of that happening anytime soon. Personally, I think the photographer should be given the opportunity to add an attribution of their choosing for each image that could also link to a web address of their choosing. Same with the caption. Could be used to provide a second link to a particular part of the client's website, while the client's name could be a link to the home page of whatever website is given in the business listing. I've only done one or two transfers but looking at one I see what you mean, the shooter's attribution is still there. I think there was some mention of the possibility of the second party transferring to a third (the idea being Photographer - Agency - Client). This might strip the original attribution but obviously would be very convoluted. Transferring from one of your own accounts to another of your own accounts may still leave you in control of editing, not sure. After I wrote my original post it occurred to me that one downside of multiple accounts would be the fact that only one account could have access to Go Thru, unless you had multiple Go Thru accounts, which would be an unnecessary expense. Certainly, I agree that the system is a mess, to the point of being not fit for professional purposes, but as I have clients that still want me to keep shooting GSV tours for them I try to find a way to get the most out of what they're giving us. Best, Aaron |
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TrustedPhotoDC private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by Metroplex360 Ability has been there for quite some time. I don't want to say from the beginning, but for a long time.  When transferring there is a 2nd attribution line added so the to-from from the transfer appears. Google has indicated this is a bug(as has Al Bug/GoThru), but like must Google bugs they seem to fix to their own agenda. |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Metroplex360 @TrustedPhotoDC @aarongeis Would you like to do a WGAN-TV Live at 5 live video Town Hall about Google Street View at 5 pm ET on Friday, 15 September 2017? I could imagine that: 1. identify your pain points 2. make recommendations 3. prioritize your wish list for Google If you let me know by 7 pm ET today (Wednesday, 6 September 2017) that this works for you, I will then invite representatives from: ✓ Google Street View ✓ GoThur ✓ LCP360 Panoskin ✓ Other Google Pros Okay? We will also record the program and post to this discussion. Best, Dan |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @TrustedPhotoDC ... SO THAT'S WHAT THAT'S FOR. 'Panorama Title' is the tooltip for this feature and I had no idea and figured it was used with the custom viewer offered by GoThru only! Thank you so much -- time to go attribute some things! |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @aarongeis @TrustedPhotoDC @Metroplex360 is confirmed for WGAN-TV Live at 5 (pm ET on Friday, 15 September 2017. @aarongeis @TrustedPhotoDC Okay with you as well? Best, Dan |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Alin @Panoskin Would you like to join-in on this WGAN-TV Live at 5 Town Hall on Google Street View? Based on this WGAN Forum discussion - and related - seems like there are some pain points of Street View Pros. While some of these pain points would need to be addressed by Google, perhaps some can be addressed by your publish to Google services. Okay? Best, Dan |
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aarongeis private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hi Dan, Yes, I could do that. Thanks for the invite. |
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Property3dNZ private msg quote post Address this user | |
 That's a Saturday morning for us and all though I love my job.... not that much lol |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by aarongeis Great! Dan |
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aarongeis private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hi Dan, My sense is that the developers (Go Thru is the one I'm most aware of) are doing what they can with what the API has to offer. If any Googler ( @armstrongc ?) was available to attend that would be fantastic. My primary pain point at the moment is the slow loading (at least 10 seconds for the initial view for each pano) for all recent uploads. My very most recent uploads have disappeared from the image carousel but I'm thinking that is a transitional problem. The slow loading has persisted for long enough that I'm worried that it is the new normal. My first recommendation would be to show businesses (potential Ad Words customers) some respect and let them curate their business listings by allowing them to remove images from their Maps image carousel directly. If they don't like an image they should be able to simply click on it and select 'remove', no filling in a form and waiting. One hotel I worked with recently was visited by the Oyster photographer just before a major refit. So they now have over a hundred photos of how their hotel used to look on their image carousel. This helps no one. My wish list is long but the idea I mentioned above, adding the ability to customise the attributions and caption including custom links would perhaps be near the top of my list. This way images of public places could include a caption and link back to the photographer's website and images of businesses could have links to relevant pages on the business' website. This would have some SEO benefit, which would be a great sales tool for us, and I don't see any downside for Google. If this was only available through the API that would be fine, that way only pro's would be in a position to offer those features to clients. I could go on for hours with recommendations and wishes but those items would be a good starting point. Best, Aaron |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @aarongeis Thank you for the additional backstory. We're a firm go for you, me and @Metroplex360 for this WGAN-TV Live at 5 (pm ET on Friday, 15 September 2017) Google Street View Roundtable. Hopefully, @TrustedPhotoDC can join us. I will reach out today (7 September 2017) with invitations to join the live video chat: ✓ Google Street View Team ✓ GoThur ✓ LCP360 Panoskin ✓ Other Google Pros We will cover: 1. identify pain points 2. make recommendations 3. prioritize wish list for Google Best, Dan |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @Property3dNZ Hope you can join the roundtable. Completely understand the time zone challenge ... Dan |
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mori private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hmmmm - I know you all don´t want to talk about this ... Google Maps/Google Earth Additional Terms of Service Last Modified: December __, 2015 +++ Does anyone know if there will be an update to this too? |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
Quote:Originally Posted by aarongeis Very true! The API is very very basic and mainly functions as an upload API. The positioning and relationships of and between submitted panos are wholly dependent on meta data which is generated from all of the visual tools custom created by GoThru. Additionally, tools to debug and fix unexpected incomplete publishing were creatively built to mitigate the publishing issues that have been reported. It is quite incredible to imagine the lengths that GoThru and other publishing platforms have gone through to provide an end to end solution. I find it curious that at the end of the day, any potential publishing platform essentially has the task of reinventing the wheel in order to compete. Go Thru is essentially better than the Business View system but lacks a few features such as automatically positioning and joining panoramas using photogrammetry. This killer feature is still sort of available if using the gsv app, but I have yet to figure out a meaningful workflow to use the two together. Quote: Originally Posted by aarongeis I completely feel your pain here. This is very very difficult to explain to customers and is awkward and very unGoogle. Quote: Originally Posted by aarongeis Preach on! The idea of unceremoniously dumping all panos to the image carousel workout a simple and reliable way to set stay points or control the initial pose has effectively turned GSV from a professional product to an experiment with promise of using AI to sort this out. Also, if the client deletes from the carousel in the way that we can from our contributions page, the panos would be deleted. My concern with this would also be the burden placed on systems like GoThru to check for updates to the tour constantly. If Google allowed this, then it would also open up the door to questions of what Google should provide tools for vs what they are off loading to the publishing platforms. Imho, the API should empower companies like Matterport and iGuide who offer automation, but Google should have continued to offer a desktop/web publishing platform as the primary submission system. If they did this and relied on their own API, possibly even open sourcing it, it would be quite interesting. Because honestly, should photographers need to care about this API and need to understand why their work is not... Working? No way! Quite a few people are struggling to manage their business due to the changes. Me thinks that these changes were done due to upper management arbitrarily slapping a mandate for departments to merge and integrate without providing the necessary resources to do so. Quote: Originally Posted by aarongeis Have you had customers request removal of tours and withheld payment for this? I have! They hate it and see this as a detrimental mess!!!! Quote: Originally Posted by aarongeis Thank you for sharing!!! |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hi All, I sent invites this morning to: Google Street View @Alin @Panoskin All Forum Members that are publishing to Google Street View - and have recommendations for Google - are welcome to join this Roundtable too ... Dan |
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WGAN Forum Founder & WGAN-TV Podcast Host Atlanta, Georgia |
DanSmigrod private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Hi All, Good news ... LCP360 ( @Panoskin ) CEO Wojciech Kalembasa will join the WGAN-TV Live at 5 Roundtable Dan |
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Frisco, Texas |
Metroplex360 private msg quote post Address this user | |
| @DanSmigrod I have been meaning to go check in to see how their platform is developing! Excited to take a look! Last time I checked in, there was one reason I chose GoThru over panoskin and it was work flow related. |
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aarongeis private msg quote post Address this user | |
| Thanks Chris! The worst I've experienced is shared disappointment with a couple of key clients. I backed off actively pushing SV to potential clients some time ago as I really don't think I can show either a current tour with the silly load times or, in good faith, an older tour that loads quickly but I can't deliver at the moment. One of my early career lessons was to not put all of my eggs in one basket but I quite liked having SV tours as one of the eggs. As much as I like a beautifully crafted custom tour I believe there's a lot to be said for the universally recognized SV UX, or rather there was. What we have now is not the universally recognized SV UX, it's an excruciating downgraded version and even the Google content jumps around confusingly. I still want to believe though. I find if I say 'Virtual Tour' people may think I'm referring to a video walkthrough or a slideshow of still images but if I say 'Street View Tour' they know exactly what to expect. So with just a small application of resources (on Google scale), everyone in the world could have access to a recognized 360 immersive platform for publishing creative and commercial works. I also think the 360 content is at a critical watershed. Within the industry, it's easy to think that there's good awareness of the 360 format and with Samsung running TV adverts for the Gear360 the public are taking some notice but, for many, it may seem like a bit of a gimmick with limited scope for creativity. As a global leader, I believe Google is in an almost unique position to really show what the format is capable of and the move to allow access to everyone is a step in the right direction but they also need to recognize that talented content creators will gravitate to the system that provides quality, functionality, and reliability. With the SV system in the state that it's in the door is wide open for other players such as FB or Roundme to steal the show from Google. On the one hand, I'm inclined not to care and just go with whatever is working at the moment but as I've been with the SVT program since it started in the UK it would suit me better to be able to continue with the same system with for the sake of continuity and consistency. So I'm hoping we'll see improvements soon. Cheers, Aaron |
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