WGAN Podcast: How Create a Matterport of a 400,000 SQFT Convention Center20563
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| WGAN-TV | How to Create a Matterport Digital Twin of a 400,000 SQ FT Convention Center | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Wednesday, 18 December 2024 | Episode: 234 | www.Meidansha-co.com | @Meidansha WGAN-TV | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha  WGAN-TV Podcast | WGAN Forum Podcast  WGAN-TV Podcast | WGAN Forum Podcast WGAN-TV Podcast | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha WGAN Forum Podcast | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha  WGAN-TV Podcast | WGAN Forum Podcast WGAN-TV Podcast | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha WGAN Forum Podcast | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha WGAN-TV eBook | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com WGAN-TV eBook | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha  WGAN-TV Training U WGAN-TV Training Academy | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com WGAN-TV Training Academy | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha WGAN-TV YouTube Channel | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha WGAN-TV YouTube Channel | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com WGAN-TV | How to Create a Matterport Digital Twin of a 400,000 SQ FT Convention Center | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Wednesday, 18 December 2024 | Episode: 234 | www.Meidansha-co.com | @Meidansha WGAN-TV | Daniel Brown with Meidansha: My Journey as a Matterport Service Provider | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Thursday, 7 November 2024 | Episode: 232 www.Meidansha-co.com @Meidansha WGAN-TV Podcast | How to Create a Matterport Digital Twin of a 400,000 SQFT Convention Center Hi All, [WGAN-TV Podcast (above) ... Transcript below] Are you wondering how to: ✓ How many days did it take to create a Matterport digital twin of the 400,000 SQ FT Kobe Convention Center? ✓ What was the pricing strategy for such a super-large space? ✓ In addition to Matterport, what other platforms, cameras and software were used for the Kobe Convention Center? Stay tuned! On WGAN-TV Live at 5 at 5 pm ET on Wednesday, 18 December 2024, our guest is: ✓ Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown Our topic is: ✓ How to Create a Matterport Digital Twin of a 400,000 SQ FT Convention Center Daniel will guide us through the complexities of documenting the Kobe Convention Center — a project that involved four large buildings, requiring unique problem-solving, multiple technologies, and strategic planning. He’ll demonstrate a deeper dive into the tour (than our previous WGAN-TV Live at 5 show), and share insights on the challenges and solutions involved in creating such a large-scale digital twin. Kobe Convention Center Tours by Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown 1. Example Tours by Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown 2. Kobe Convention Center (400,000 SQ FT) | Tour by https://virtualtour.productions/kobe_convention_center/kkc2024/index.htm 3. Kobe Convention Center is a complex of 4 Large Buildings (Here is one of the buildings.) https://3d.walkthroughs.online/show/?m=HDSJBxoVgvu 4. Kobe International Exhibition Hall 2 | Includes Scans from a Leica BLK360 G1 https://3d.walkthroughs.online/show/?m=V1Tz56PTino Some of the questions I will ask Daniel: 1. Project Origin: How did this project come about? ✓ How did you connect with the tourism board for this project? ✓ Did they approach you or did you reach out to them? ✓ How did you first understand the scale and scope of the project? 2. Quoting and Pricing: How did you approach pricing for such a large project? ✓ What was your pricing strategy for a project of this scale? ✓ Did you charge a fixed fee, bill by the day, charge by the SQ FT? ✓ How did you estimate the number of days or resources required for the project? 3. Understanding the Client's Needs: What were the use cases for the digital twin? ✓ How did the tourism board plan to use the digital twin of the Kobe Convention Center? ✓ Was the goal primarily marketing, or were there operational uses as well? ✓ Were there specific features they wanted to highlight in the tour? 4. Tools and Technology: What software and hardware were used to create the digital twin? ✓ Which cameras did you use? (e.g., Matterport Pro2, Leica BLK360, DSLR, 360 camera) ✓ What software platforms did you use? ✓ How did you decide which tools were best for the project’s requirements? 5. Problem Solving: What challenges did you encounter with such a large space? ✓ What were the unique challenges with scanning a 400,000 square foot space? ✓ How did you manage large open spaces that may not have many visual reference points? ✓ Were there any lighting challenges in different parts of the convention center? ✓ How did you overcome GPS or connectivity issues while scanning? 6. Workflow and Execution: How did you organize the workflow for this large-scale project? ✓ How many scanning days did this project require? ✓ How did you ensure continuity when scanning different sections of the building over time? ✓ What was your approach for balancing speed and quality in such a large project? 7. Managing Multiple Technologies: How did you integrate various tools and platforms? ✓ How did you manage the use of multiple platforms (Matterport, 3DVista, MPEmbed, Google Earth)? ✓ Did you use different tools for different sections of the building? ✓ How did you maintain consistency between different types of media (3D scans, photos, 360 panoramas)? 8. Deliverables: What was delivered to the client and in what format? ✓ What were the final deliverables for the project? ✓ How did you package the tour for easy use by the client? ✓ Did you provide training or support on how to use and share the digital twin? 9. Client Feedback and Results: What was the client’s response to the final product? ✓ How did the client react to the completed tour? ✓ Were there any follow-up requests or additional features they wanted? ✓ How has the tourism board been using the digital twin since its delivery? 10. Lessons Learned: What would you do differently if you could start the project again? ✓ Were there any surprises during the project that you didn’t anticipate? ✓ Looking back, is there anything you would change about how you approached the project? ✓ What advice would you give to someone taking on a project of this scale for the first time? Why This Matters for Real Estate Photographers For real estate photographers used to documenting homes of 3,500 square feet, tackling a 400,000 square foot project introduces entirely new challenges and complexities. From dealing with large open spaces to managing multiple technologies, Daniel’s experience can offer invaluable lessons for anyone looking to expand their business into larger commercial projects. What other questions should I ask Daniel during this WGAN-TV Live at 5 show? Best, Dan Daniel John Brown Links ✓ Meidansha Inc. President ✓ LinkedIn: Daniel John Brown ✓ Daniel Brown on Flickr |
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| WGAN-TV | How to Create a Matterport Digital Twin of a 400,000 SQ FT Convention Center | Guest: Meidansha Inc. President Daniel Brown | Wednesday, 18 December 2024 | Episode: 234 | www.Meidansha-co.com | @Meidansha Transcript (video above) - How many days did it take to create a Matterport digital twin of the 400,000 square foot Kobe Convention Center? - What was the pricing strategy for such a super-large space? - In addition to Matterport, what other platforms, cameras and software were used for the Kobe Convention Center? Stay tuned. Hi, all, I'm Dan Smigrod, founder of the [www.WeGetAroundNetworkForum.com]. Today is Wednesday, December 18th, 2024. You're watching WGAN-TV Live at 5: a podcast for digital twin creators shaping the future of real estate today. We have an awesome show for you: How to Create a Matterport Digital Twin of a 400,000 square foot Convention Center. Our guest today is Osaka-based Daniel Brown, president of Maidansha, Inc. Daniel. - Hi. - Thank you for being back on the show. - Hi. Thank you. - Daniel, before we dive into today's topic, tell us about my Maidansha - today. - So Maidansha is a company that makes 3D spatial imaging for businesses and helps to create the digital twins that they need for their work. Also, we make predominantly virtual tours for the building and tourism industries in Japan. - And the kind of categories of clients? - So predominantly it's hotels. Also it's for building companies such as residential building companies. Japan has a very big market for new homes. So the companies require our services to give a display of previous homes that they've built, which are used when clients and potential clients contact them online for costings and for general information about the company. So we sort of help them make that first step of connecting with their potential customers. - And some other categories of clients? - So for instance, we've done work in the past year for, apart from hotels, tourism, we've done work for MICE: Meetings, Incentives, Conventions and Events. So that's particularly what we're going to be talking about today. - Awesome. And your coverage area in Japan is? - So Japan's not a very big country. So we can cover the whole country. So most of our work is centered around where I am in Osaka this past year. But in years gone by, we've done work pretty evenly across the country. So yeah, we cover the whole country. - And the kinds of virtual tours? We know Matterport, but are there other platforms, other cameras that you're using as well? - Yes, so we check with the client to see what they need first. Often they don't know the jargon or the company branding names, et cetera. So we make sure that they want 3D or whether they want high quality, high resolution, 360 photographs, et cetera. So we can do, when we talk about it from a specialist side, we can use 3DVista, we can use Cupix, we can use Matterport as you mentioned before, pretty much if the client wants it and we have the equipment on hand, we'll do whatever it is they want. - Great, can you show us the Kobe Convention Center in [Kobe]? - Sure. - And for the purpose of showing and telling us about the Kobe Convention Center, why don't we just assume that I have a conference, I'm in the United States and I'm traveling -- I have an expected turnout of 50,000 people and this is both a conference and exhibition. So I can see your screen. Perhaps you could walk me through the Kobe Convention Center with that lens of anticipation of 50,000 attendees, conference and exhibit. - So I imagine that the staff that asked me to make the tour in the first place are watching today, so I can't give the same kind of level of sales expertise here. But the request that we had to make the tour, I can explain in reference to 50,000 people coming. So first of all, you would have to see it on a greater map of the Kobe City area. But the facility ... The facility is built on a man-made island which stretches out from Kobe City and it's connected by this line you can see in the middle here, this is a monorail and it has a station, right centered, excuse me, centered in the middle. So the monorail moves, I think every five minutes or so, there's a five to 10 minute time, there's a monorail train that comes. And so at the end of the island there is an airport which is not shown here. And at the base of the island, there is the main city area for Kobe, which is centered around an area called Sannomiya. Now, from there, people would come to the train area here, the train station, and on what is the east side here, the right side would be the Kobe Convention Center, the Kobe International Meeting Hall would be the correct name for this in English. So it's about 8,000 square meters of floor space and has numerous rooms for smaller and larger meetings, as well as a great big theater in the first floor; on the basement to first floor here. Also for international visitors, though it's not featured in the tour, this is a hotel called Kobe Portopia Hotel. Perhaps at some point in the future there may be an expression of interest from them. And on the left side, which is actually the west side of the man-made islands, we have three white buildings here, they are the Kobe International Exhibition Halls one, two, and three. These vary in size, but the biggest is number two, followed by one and then three. These can all on their own host huge exhibitions, but collectively they can be used as well, from what I understand. - Daniel, when I've been given tours of convention spaces, I've never seen this whole rotation that you were doing here. Even before I get into the tour, I was just curious to see this space. - Are you talking about this? - Yes, yes. - Yes, so I think this is one of the things that helped the people at the convention center make the decision to go with Maidansha's offer as opposed to other businesses, because there was competition. - Yes. - For this particular job- - Actually, we'll talk about that if you just assume I'm really, I'm trying to bring my international convention. So I'm just curious. - Sure. - The Kobe Convention Center and its capabilities here. - Sure. Oh, yeah. So people who open this, it's intended as a landing page can open it and then they can move it around if they want to. But really it's just intended, it's a landing page. From here, they can press any of these four buttons or they can click the Japanese writing at the top of these sort of markers, which you can see stay anchored. I've prepared ahead of time the links. So if you open one of them, like let's say we opened this one, it would display something like this. This is the Kobe International Meeting Hall. So we're starting actually from the top floor at the request of the client. If we zoom back out again into what Matterport calls the dollhouse mode, you can see we can do the same kind of, how do I say, functionality as we could with the overall scene, the outdoor exterior scene. And except that now you can see the inside of the building. So we can break this up to see separate floors. For instance, starting from the basement floor, you can see the theater that I mentioned earlier and other floors appear sort of half faded out. But we can zoom in particularly. - Can we? Yes. Can we take a look at those spaces? The theater and the, let's do the theater. - Sure, so if we enter the theater by double clicking, we can now see from the audience's view what the theater looks like and also the view of the screen. And if we dive to the front, we can actually see from the people on stage, what they would see here. Obviously the lights are very bright, so it does actually cause some lens flaring with the camera we used. But you can also see behind the scenes too. So we checked closely with the staff to see just how much they wanted to be shown and they were quite happy with showing just what the green room, for instance, looks like, what it looks like behind the stage to give people who are considering using the show an idea of just what kind of facilities are available. - Yes, that's helpful for us to understand the wings and what equipment, gear, and space is backstage. - Yes, so I think that just about concludes what's on this floor, but it does actually, you can actually see the waiting areas that the staff would be using as well as the green room, et cetera. - Except the green room doesn't look green. - Yeah, VIP room. Yeah.  So I could get into detail talking about this from a scanning technician's point of view, but I'll just stick to what the user sees, so you can see this is the waiting area where people would go in and out before and during the show. And if we go one more floor up, we can see the foyer like this. The building itself is about 30 years old I think, but it has new attachments here and there. It's very well maintained. So yeah, you can see some things that sort of, how do I say, it's nostalgic in some places, yes. But overall, being that I spent a lot of time in this area, in this building, I can say that it's a very, very well maintained building. Was there anything else you would like to see in the building? - I'd like to see the exhibit space, the expo spaces. - Sure. Well this particular building was intended for meetings, but if we go to one of the exposition spaces- - Were there other meeting spaces within this building? We do have some small breakout rooms, needs for breakout rooms, conference rooms. - Sure. - Classroom? - If we use this menu or the dollhouse feature as I showed before, we can move to different rooms. So for instance, if we go to the menu, we can see some of the meeting rooms, like if I click 401 here, We instantly transported to 401, which is this kind of regular run-of-the-mill kind of meeting room. This one is laid out just for what they would call a school type of meeting here in Japan. - Yes. - Whereas, they have other rooms with multiple layouts. If I zoom to one of those using the menu again, for instance, if we go to 405 just down the hallway, a smaller room, but this at the moment is laid out in this sort of round format. But if we click this button, we can see another school format. Like this. And in places there are rooms set up with a projector, so you can see what they call a theater format. So if we go to 403, again, we have the round format, but if we click the button, it gives us a view of what it looks like if it's set up for viewing a slideshow or something like that. And otherwise, with regard to these buttons, we've used them to show photographs of the exterior. We've also used them to show small PDFs of what the map of the building looks like. So if we go to one of those, okay, I would have to go to a separate building to show you that. But for instance, this is one of the exhibition halls. - Yes, thank you. - Yeah. And the exhibition halls all have provided, they're separately managed, but they all provided some PDFs of floor plans. So for instance, we go to the second floor, they have a floor plan like this, which they provided in PDF form with some simple explanation here. And PDFs for those familiar with the software MPEmbed will know that they can open in a separate tab like this and be PDFs that can be downloaded as well. And the exhibition hall features the same kind. - How many exhibition halls, expo spaces are there within the three buildings? Is that literally, there's three? - Okay, so from memory, this is the first exhibition hall. It has two exhibition spaces. So you can see here, when we look at it in 3D, the ground floor is roughly the same size as the exhibition spaces. The one on the ground first floor has a much higher ceiling, about 15, 20 meters I think. And it's supported by these large concrete columns. Whereas the second floor is completely open, the ceiling is a bit lower. You saw the second floor just now, if we just give you a quick look at the first floor, it's like this. Then in the other two exhibition halls, there is one large exhibition space each, the second hall is the largest of all of them. Let me just give you a look at that. You can see that this floor space is massive. This is the largest space of all of the buildings that I scanned in this complex. The echo in there is pretty amazing. If there is nothing going on in there, if there's no chairs or anything placed, it echoes about five or six times. So the third hall is a newer but smaller hall, but still, nonetheless very big. This is the final space. So you can just see by the number of lights, we're talking at least 30 meters, I guess, across by about 70 or 80 meters wide, I think just from memory. - And is there a floor plan for this space? Yep. - Yeah, the floor plan. I initially, if we talk slightly from a specialist point of view, initially I tried to include this floor plan as the background map here that you see. But there were some issues with the size of this space. Its exterior and the size of the floor plan to make that a little bit difficult. - Right, we'll talk about that in a moment. Can I see where the loading bays are? - Sure, this one has a very large loading base, so we can see what the exterior looks like by clicking one of these tags. And then we get this view, the loading bay area. Actually there's an interesting story behind this photograph, but do we have time for it? I'm not sure. - We'll come back. Is there anything else about the space itself, about the Kobe Convention Center? We've looked at expo halls. We looked at classrooms. We looked at the foyers, into the spaces. We looked at the overview of all four buildings. Before we take it off screen share and talk about the project, is there anything else to show in terms of this space? - In terms of the space? So I've shown three functionalities, which I sort of hoped that people would pick up on. One was the exterior like this. - Yeah. - Then of course there was, people are much familiar with the Matterport interior. - Alright, I'll tell you what, let's take it off screen share and we'll talk about the project. - Sure. - That'd be great. Cool. Thank you. We're ready to book our 50,000 attendees and expo. Who do I need to talk to? - I would put you in touch with the Kobe Convention Center management team and I think you'll find our tour and a lot of information on their website about that. - Thank you. So, what has been the reaction? This is 400,000 square feet, I believe you did this project; available publicly April, 2024. - That's correct. - What's been the reaction of the Kobe Convention Center team? - In the lead up to this interview? I actually asked them in detail about these things. As I expected, they were very happy with what they got from the tour. But importantly for me, myself, not just the people who asked me from the management team, but also the people on the ground who use the tour too are also finding it very useful for assisting in their daily work there. - I imagine there's many different use cases of this tour. Can you talk about that? - Sure. Okay. So initially what they were looking for was, they wanted, just one moment, sorry. Initially what they were looking for was the ability for people remote to be able to see what the facilities are like. So they could grasp just the size and the amenities available, et cetera, that sort of thing. And they would have situations where they would have people come onsite to look and they would spend time showing them around the facility. And as you could see before, from the exterior view, it's a very, very large area. So this viewing takes close to an hour sometimes. So they wanted it to facilitate the viewing for people who couldn't come on site, either from time restrictions or because they were too far away. And sometimes if it's a big organization that wants to use the facility, they may have some local people who come on site, but other people who are in the decision making process who are offsite. So they wanted to be able to share that information with both people on and offsite. That was the main functionality that they were looking for. But after actually receiving the tour, they tell me that they're also using it internally as well. So for instance, to facilitate communication between people who work on site. So I mean it's easy to say it's that thing over there, but, without the specifics, it's kind of hard to know exactly where in the complex they're talking about. So they can use the tour to explain these things to each other when they're in a meeting. I also explain to them if we talk about the specialist dynamics of the Matterport tour, how to use deep links to explain these things in meetings, et cetera, and they were very happy with that. And also, yeah? - So I think I'm hearing three things. One is for sales purposes- - That's right. - Talking to potential clients internationally that may or may not travel to [Kobe] to look at the facilities. And it may be that showing the tour is what leads to getting an in-person appointment to take it to the next step. I imagine, I think what I'm also hearing is marketing in general to lead to potential leads that then lead to coming to Osaka to visit in person and have meetings- - Kobe. - Forgive me. - It's kind of like a New York, New Jersey relationship. - I'm so sorry, Kobe. I don't know why I have Osaka on my brain. - No problem. - Kobe. So... And then I think the third brush stroke that I'm hearing is from, "okay we've booked our space but now we have a planning need operationally" and that may be taking measurements, that may be doing a virtual walkthrough. So operationally it's being used as well. - That's correct. They mentioned layouts as well. So yeah, that's the kind of operational use that they're using it for. - And I could imagine that part of that is deciding, okay, are we setting it up as classroom style? Are we setting it up in some other meeting style and being able to take measurements in order to determine can you put in 20 rows, 50 rows, whatever it might be in that style? - That's correct. They did specifically mention the measurement tool as being useful. - As being powerful. Okay. Sales, marketing, operations. Any other use cases that your client has identified? - So to date, I have heard these only, but I imagine there's other little uses that they have that come up from time to time. - This really is an extraordinary project. I would imagine that it's actually already led to additional business for Maidansha for your company. - Yes, so it does draw a lot of attention and from what I understand, these publicly run facilities do actually talk to each other. So in different cities in different, well we call them prefectures here, but you would call them states. So they had an inquiry about how the tour was made from another more distanced state, prefecture. And through them we got a referral to that particular place. So we can't say with certainty when, but they're very positive on doing something similar for their complex as well. - Awesome. I know in general we said Matterport, but there's lots of different platforms, software, cameras that were used in the creation of this tour. Could you talk to us about that? - Sure, so initially what I showed you was the exterior view, that was made using 3DVista as a kind of a landing page. I've used 3DVista to make complete tours before, but it sort of in this particular case fills a gap that's hard to fill with Matterport. So the exterior of buildings, while not impossible with Matterport, is very, very time consuming and also difficult. So yeah, just using that exterior visual was something that helped me get the contract and also it helped them to sort of show just how convenient the facilities actually are. The actual visual itself is what you want to know? - Yeah, it is. - Yeah. - Yes, please. - Yeah, so the visual itself comes from Google, Google Map or Google Earth. It's a sort of a three dimensional screenshot. Since then, Google has released some kind of mapping tiles API, but ours was sort of predating that. So we have a still screenshot of what the scene looked like on Google Map circa mid last year. So at the time we had to sort of supply referrals to the places, to the companies that made the original data. So that included Google as well as Airbus and a few other companies. So that's all denoted in the tour. So with those hurdles covered, we had an exterior shot of the building area. I would've loved to have made that using say photogrammetry or something like that. But unfortunately close proximity to an airport and combined with the fact that some very, very large areas just meant there wasn't the budget available or the time to make it in the first place. If we move on to the inside, it was made with Matterport. The Matterport was created using two cameras. So we used predominantly the Matterport Pro2 Camera. Then in places we would use the Leica, the Leica BLK360 Generation 1, which is the only Leica camera that Matterport software supports. The Leica has a sort of a lopsided set of abilities, I guess is the best way to put it because its 3D capture functionalities are probably better than any camera that Matterport software supports, but its photographic capabilities are like less than 4K. So it is a very poor photograph that they create. So we use the two cameras with their own unique abilities to sort of support each other. The Pro2 has probably the best capture resolution of any camera that is supported by Matterport unless you're going to shoot DSLR and it shoots six 4K photos and then sort of combines that together to make a 16K photo. Then you've got the Leica with the 3D as I mentioned before. Yeah, go ahead. - There was a discussion in the [www.WGANForum.com], member @AndrewMaydaa had posted about some discussion about the Pro2 versus the Matterport Pro3 Camera and you weighed in on that. Could you talk us through the, perhaps either why you used the Leica BLK360- - Yes, absolutely. - 1st Generation versus a Matterport Pro3 Camera and the difference perhaps of the Pro3 versus the Leica BLK360 or the Pro3 versus the Matterport Pro2 Camera. Can you take us through- - Sure. - From a Matterport Service Provider perspective? - Okay, I think this really comes down to when you started. So if you started as I did five or six years ago, then you had a situation before the Pro3 came out when you needed to do outdoor. So most of us would've bought a Pro3 or told our clients, "sorry, we can't do that." And in that case we just didn't have the option to turn our clients down. So we made that investment going back to 2020. So- - That's about a $21,000 investment versus $6,000- - Yes, it was pretty big at the time. - Matterport Pro3 Camera. Yeah. - Yeah, so when the Pro3 came out, there was a lot of excitement because that really brought the price tag down. But to inform people of what's happened in between the Leica Generation 1 is no longer being made. So if you're going to buy it, you're going to have to buy it secondhand. But that's not to say that that's a good option, a bad option because a lot of the secondhand stuff that's on the market, it's really underused. So that's the reason it's on the market in the first place. So if you are very careful, you can get a pretty good camera for a very reasonable price. The reason I went for the Leica is obviously the Pro3 wasn't available at the time, but if I was starting now and I had a big job like this one, I probably would buy a Pro3. The only clear advantage the Pro3 has over both the Pro2 and the Leica is the speed. So the speed has also to be put against the fact that the battery needs to be recharged. So when you get to talk about batteries, then definitely the Pro2 is the better one of the three cameras there. So if you are shooting a lot in one day, like say eight to nine hours, then yeah, the Pro2 is going to be a workhorse because- - Even with the swapping out of the batteries on the Pro3 being swappable and the Pro2 not being swappable? - Okay, obviously with the Pro3, you could prepare a number of batteries and they just keep them charging and sort of perpetually keep them going. But although I don't want to say anything too negative about the camera in an interview, I have heard from a lot of people that when sustaining, like using the Pro3 of a very sustained period of time, it is known to have other issues come up and then they've had to swap the Pro2 anyway. So yeah, for that particular reason, I would save the Pro3 for where it's needed most as opposed to using it as the main workhorse, I think. - And could you just compare perhaps the, because you went into detail on this, on the Matterport Pro3 Camera versus the Matterport Pro2 Camera on the image quality. - Okay. So- - It seemed counterintuitive to say, "oh, new generation camera Pro3, actually the image quality is not as good as the Pro2." I think that was the point that you were making in the [Www.WeGetAroundNetwork.com] - Okay, so image quality is something that is pretty broad term. So we have to start with talking about resolution or are we talking about HDR quality, for instance. So if we're talking about resolution, the capture resolution that the Pro2 uses is much higher than the Pro3. So this is maybe not so visible on a regular PC screen when you're seeing the two indoor shots lined up. Because you're probably not going to use the Pro2 much outdoors, but also when you are, for instance, taking photographs from Matterport, as most people will know, there's a functionality where you can take snapshots within the tour. Until about three or four months ago, you could get up to 8K photos in any direction from the Pro2, but you could only get 6K or so from the Pro3. The difference there was the original capture resolution that the cameras used. So as I mentioned briefly before, the Pro2 takes a six skybox spaces, so it's like a cube of, in 4K, whereas the Pro3 does the same at half the resolution. So the result is still the same because they merge the photos into a 16K 360 image. So obviously the Pro2 has to sort of compress that original capture image quality. But the difference is if you want to then take that information from the originals and then create a regular snapshot that you have more to play with, with the Pro2, unfortunately in the last few months, it seems that Matterport has made some changes to the platform. So now when you take those snapshots, they're all anchored to the Pro3's abilities. So you can't get more than 6K anymore for those snapshots. But that just shows you the difference that's going on in the background there between the two cameras. - Okay. Would you have been at any disadvantage using a Pro3 instead of a BLK360? - Oh, I don't think so. But- - Could you have used the Pro3 instead of the Pro2? So just being able to use one camera for the entire project? - I could have done, but the one thing that I would be concerned about is, does my client have, well the two things I would say, one would be, does my client have a Matterport Classic Account or do they have a Matterport newer account? If they have the Classic Account, then I can't service them with the Pro3. That's one thing. The second thing would be if I use the Pro3, I said I didn't really want to say anything negative about the camera, but if I wanted to exclusively use the Pro3, I have heard that a number of people, not just on [the www.WGANForum.com], but also on Facebook groups and even from people I know in Japan, that the Pro3 has a habit of throwing a few technical difficulties, shall we say, from time to time. And whereas the Leica does throw technical difficulties at you too, they tend to be more about compatibility with Matterport and they can be overcome by just turning the thing off and turning it back on again. The Pro3s technical difficulties tend to be more mechanical. So yeah, I would feel risky about that. - For a project this size you'd want to have a backup Matterport Pro3 Camera. - A backup at least. Yes. - So continuing our discussion of technology, were there other platforms like that, and other cameras, can you speak to that? - Sure, I dunno about platforms, but we use the well-known SDK, MPEmbed, to help to optimize the tours for our client's needs. The menu you saw before, I didn't show it in my explanation, but it had a snapshots button, so not just the people who have access to the Matterport Cloud account, but also regular users are able to take screenshots from any part of the tour that they want. So MPEmbed came in useful for those things. And also behind the scenes too, when creating the tour, despite the fact that there were enough points to cover the entire tour to create the 3D image that you saw of the dollhouse. In some spaces there would be holes in the walls, for instance. And so clicking at a certain point, will send you flying across the other wings of the building. So we used MPEmbed's 3D models function to plug those holes. Also, conversely, we found that because the space was so big from time to time, there was kind of noise appearing in doorways and things. So the noise there was actually becoming a physical obstruction to moving through a doorway, we'd been careful to make sure that we always scanned with the doors open. So we weren't sure why these were appearing, but they do. So what we did is we used a 3D model with a deep link attached to it. So the model itself is invisible, it's just like sort of a rectangle in the doorway that if you click the doorway, you're instantly transported through the doorway to get to the other side. So it sort of took away that inconvenience for the user. - So that was a feature of MPEmbed? - That's correct, yeah. - Overlaid on top of the Matterport tour- - Yes. - To deal with some particular challenges and magically make them go away. - Yes, that's correct. So yeah, this is sort of a behind the scenes feature. - Okay, other cameras? - Finally, platforms, I dunno if it's a platform, but we included, as you saw before, ideas of what different layouts look like with 360 photos. We opted to take them with a DSLR or actually it's a mirrorless camera and combine them together using software such as PTGui and they were all HDR shots with several exposures for each direction. So then we also used a software called Photomatix to merge them. Then finally Affinity Photos sort of made the photos' final edits to put them in place. The reason we opted to do this and not use, let's say the Pro2's 360 capture was because a lot of time would move in between, so the space would look very different. It was hard to find the right spot. And also those black circles with 360 are written on them that Matterport creates, are not as intrinsic as I would like. So for instance, people see them, they press them and they don't know how to get back out again. So I thought to try and keep the same kind of interface as we had for all the other tags that we had in the tour was probably the best way to go. So we included these tags in a different color so people would be able to sort of intrinsically understand that they're seeing a popup, not another room in the tour. - Such a massive project. Problems that turned up while shooting? - I expected more problems than we had, but my client was very, very supportive and helpful. So basically we had the rooms all to ourselves the whole time. So there were very few or very few cases where we had to stop work at any one time. And the problems that sort of came up that sort of, I hadn't considered beforehand, for instance, just one moment. - So I imagine some of the problems that you did anticipate with those very large spaces- - Yes. - Using the Matterport Pro2 on this very wide open space, you probably even anticipated there was never a chance that you'd be able to successfully scan with the Matterport Pro2 Camera in ginormous open spaces. - That's correct, yes. - So- - I was aware ahead of time that that would be a challenge if I was trying to use the Pro2. So hence, yes. - What was your solution of how to actually scan the large spaces? - Yeah, so as I said before, we're using a Leica BLK360. The Leica is sort of made for that sort of space. It takes a long time to shoot any one particular spot, but when it does, it'll take a massive radius so you can reduce the number of scans that you need. And very rarely- - Did you match up with the Pro2 though, in terms of making- - That's correct. - Doing the perimeter of the interiors with the Pro2 for photography perhaps? And- - That's correct. - BLK360 to actually capture the floor to ceiling and be able to have the scans connected, yeah. - That's correct. If we talk about how I handled those rooms in particular, if we have a rectangular room like this, maybe say 100 feet by, sorry, I'm just trying to get my calculations right there. - Thank you for doing this. Yes. - 100 feet. 100 feet by say 700 feet or something like that. Let's just say we've got this huge room like this and what I would then do is I would, first of all, we initially need that one Pro2 shot to be able to combine the two scans together. I don't know why, but just the way that the Matterport Capture app works, you have to have a Pro2 shot before using any Leica BLK360 shot after that. So we do that one shot and then if there were multiple technicians working at the same time, we'd transfer that one shot to a second iPad, then that shot would be like, say in a doorway between the large open hall and another room. So then what we would do is we'd be both armed with that one Pro2 shot and separately we would start shooting with Leicas. So in different directions. - Did you have four team members shooting simultaneously? You had four buildings and I noticed the tours were not all merged into one tour. So with four separate buildings, did you have four people shooting simultaneously at time? - We had, at any one time we only had two people, but there were three of us. And initially I had been asked, this is, the conversation's going to go back and forth a little bit, but initially when I was asked to provide an offer for the tour, I was asked to be able to do it in one month. So I asked the two other members, they're not my employees, they are other MSPs that work in Osaka and Kyoto. I asked them to assist me. So we do that for each other when we get big projects because if we don't, it's kind of hard to sort of appeal to these large projects when you're just one guy on your own. So anyway, yeah, I asked the two of them to help me out through most of the scanning. And so what ended up happening is that we managed to make an offer where we could scan this huge space in just 14 days. And I think there was a month pause I think after that where obviously the client was looking for the various [Vendors] and the pricing and the functionalities offered because they're all a little different. And finally they came back to us. - I'm sorry, translate for me. Tenders in the US means? - Ah, sorry. Okay, so I might even be using the wrong term. So we had- - Vendor? A vendor? - Vendors, yeah, so there are other- - Potential vendors. - There were other offers being made. So ours won out in the end, but when they actually came back to us, they said instead of a month, you can do it over three months, which was much better for me. So obviously as I had already promised my subcontractors some work, we still did some of the areas together, but for the most part it was myself alone after that. So as I was saying, two of us were on the Leica and we had that initial Pro2 shot and then we started in different directions to scan the respective large spaces. The way it works with the Leica though is that the Leica internally stores its scan information inside the Leica. So this is 2023, Autumn 2023. So the option to merge spaces in Matterport didn't exist at the time, but what you can do is if you use the method we just talked about, you can transfer that internal information from the Leica to a different iPad. So as we both started with the same Matterport Pro2 point, and we have information that connects, so then they would, we'd have one person with an iPad Pro who would be the master iPad, and another guy with the second iPad Pro who'd be the sub, the guy who was checking his work on the sub would then transfer the information from the Leica into the master iPad. So by this very complicated method, we were able to sort of scan two people at the same time on one Matterport space without having to ask Matterport to merge the spaces later. Then the final step was to fill the gaps with more photographic Pro2 shots. So the Pro2 shots, as you said before, we could sort of work our way around the outside, but we couldn't get into the middle. So take a few of those photographic shots, which would actually stay in the tour that people would actually be able to move into in the tour. And then from there they'd be able to see not only the 3D created by the Leica, but the photographic element made by the Pro2. We sort of tried to get some shots in the middle of the room, but it was sort of a very complicated process where you had to sort of work your way back to the middle by making a kind of a triangle, like a set of bowling pins, if what I mean. But just that middle point was always sort of evasive. So we only did that when we had time. - And what was the purpose of, you were trying to do a Pro2 scan in the middle of the space? - Yes. Just one for show. So the person- - Because the quality of the photography is better. - That's right. - Than the like a BLK360 and therefore- - That's correct. - If you wanted to stand in the middle of the space and look around, you were trying to give people the best photographic experience if possible, which was technically quite a challenge because of a big wide open space and the challenge- - That's correct. - Of using a Pro2. Okay. - So this would've been a really good use case for a Pro3. - Pro3, yeah. - Yeah. - Okay, were there, I mean, I could think in a large space like this, you might have challenges with scans disconnecting. - With the Leica, never. - Yeah, but the Pro2, I meant. - Yeah, of course. As I mentioned just now. Yeah. - So with, what we call that a failure, a scan failure, a- - Alignment errors. - Alignment error, thank you. An alignment error, was that a huge problem or no, you anticipated that, that was part of your calculations of how long it would take to do the project? That- - I didn't, I can only recall once or twice where I got an alignment error and both times with Pro2. So basically, yeah, with a good foundation laid by the Leica, it was very rare to get alignment errors. - Okay, before I move on to a new topic, was there anything else in terms of challenges that was unexpected and how you solved the puzzle? - So there was just one occasion, I think I showed you a picture of a loading dock before. So the client had asked me to take a picture, just a regular photograph of the loading dock. And I had done that, it was a sunny day and the inside was obviously relatively dark, so I had done a nine exposure HDR composition, but the result was good, but the client was so impressed with the other 360 photos I'd made that they wanted to do that loading dock spot in 360 as well. So I returned to the same spot a few weeks later and took the shot. But when I took the shot, there was scheduled maintenance going on inside the loading dock area, so I had to take the picture with the door closed. So I showed the picture with the door closed to the client and they said they wanted me to come back and do it a third time. So I said, just hang on, let me see what I can do with Affinity Photo. And I took my first photograph, which was just like a regular photograph, not a 360 or anything like that. And I took the open part and I used a mask, a layer mask to insert that into the 360 photo in Affinity and it worked. So I actually managed to get the inside looking good and the outside looking good. It was just lucky I'd chosen more or less the same position to take both photos, yeah. - All right, cool. Let's go back to the beginning. How did this project even come about? - So initially I received this email from the Kobe Convention Center. They had a list of very specific requirements of what they wanted done, including equipment wise. So I mentioned the Leica many times, which was actually written in their request. Then they told me that they'd been specifically looking for photographers in Kobe or Osaka because they understood that the tour was going to take a long time to capture. So they didn't want people staying long term in hotels nearby or anything like that. So yeah, that was the main reason that I was notified because I'm one of a small number of Matterport photographers whose [www.Meidansha-Co.com] sticks out in this Osaka area, also, I don't know for sure whether they saw it, but I'd done lot of work in Kobe City before, for instance, they had a city hall, a wing of city hall which was going to be torn down and I used it on the one hand to practice and on the other hand to, on the other hand to give the city an archive of what the hall looked like, the building looked like, it was a very big building too and I'd done it completely with the Matterport Pro2. So yeah, it was good practice for me, but also I think it's quite possible that they may have seen that tour before, making a decision to reach out to me as well. - Okay, so they reach out to you, they express interest, what happens next? - So I was given a viewing of the facility and it struck me at the time just how much these people need the tour because the viewing took an hour or so to walk around all the buildings and so on. And even then it was sort of cut short. So yeah, I wasn't the only one who was given a viewing. The other, you said vendors before, were all separately given viewings independently, so we never met each other, but yeah, that was the sort of thing that happened next, yeah. - Right, if I could ask you just maybe to sit up a little bit, I'm losing you on the bottom of this. - Sure, go ahead. Sure. - Thank you. So, okay, so now it comes time to submit a quote. Is it by square foot, is it by hour? Is it by day? Is it some other formula? How did you approach this project? - So it was kind of a combination of square foot and days because from previous experience, I knew that these big projects, if you just give it by the square feet or the meterage, that the client sort of allows it to stretch, the tour to stretch, they don't give you priority. Whereas if you are charging them by the day, your time becomes their money. So they try to help you a lot more to sort of speed the process, if what I mean, as it would turn out, my client was extremely helpful so that I didn't need that sort of extreme measure to be taken. But at any rate, one other reason for sort of mixing the two formulas was because the client had square footage, or I should say meterage here in Japan for the actual event spaces themselves, but they didn't have square footage for say, the foyer area or the connecting hallways, et cetera. So that had to sort of be extrapolated from building totals square footage. So we had building total square footage for each building and we had the actual exhibition space square footage, but there's a gap. So in one particular building's case that had large sort of waiting areas and stuff, 40% was actual rented out space with actual clear square footage, et cetera. But the other 60% was just like a mystery. We didn't know how much was actually going to be scanned on any particular day. So I had to sort of make kind of a formula to work out just how much I was going to be scanning each part for each day. So when I was doing this, I sort of thought, charging by the square footage is going to be really hard for this building, so I better do this day by day, if you know what I mean. - So, and so how did you figure out how many days to, that this project would take? - So we had the total building square meterage or footage. So what we did is we worked out from there how many days it was going to take. And so I decided, let's just say things are going to happen on the ground and we're going to move at a pretty - I wouldn't say slow, but measured pace. If that's the case, it's going to be 35 days. I determined to do this site, 400,000 square feet of space. - Was there- - As it turned out, it took 30. - Number of feet per square foot, then you went through a- - That's correct. - An actual calculation, so. - So I think if we're talking square feet, it turned out to be something like 1,400 square feet [an hour] or something like that. As it turned out, we'd probably move closer to 2,000 square feet [an hour] anyway. So, but- - Per hour, not per day. - Sorry, per hour. Yeah, sorry my numbers are out because I'm not accustomed to using square feet. - Square feet. So it- - Yes, square hour. You're right. - At 1,400 square feet per hour times eight hours. - That's correct. - Came- - So yeah. - Divided by 400,000 square feet comes out to about 35 days. - That's right, as you say. - And then how many days did it actually take you? - So we managed to get that out in 30 days, but even so it was quite casual, I wouldn't say casual, but we were able to try new things, like we had enough time to do that, so yeah. - And then I imagine that, that wasn't 30 days in a row. So what was the, did you use, did it take three months to, of the lapse time? - Yes, so three months or maybe even a little over. So we would have a week of solid scanning at one point and then maybe just one day in a separate week. And the reason is because there are many functions and many exhibitions going on and it was all during the autumn period of 2023. So I guess it's probably similar in the climate, like North America and so on. But once it cools down a bit, those big events sort of start up and that was one of the reasons that we had to sort of stop and start, yeah. - And what did, what actually got delivered? Was it an MPEmbed link? - So the deliverables were as you've seen them, mainly link form and also we did provide them with the original data for things that we could, like, such as the photographs, also for the backup for the 3D Vista landing page, et cetera. Also we provide them, not a deliverable as such, but with a one year contract to give them analytics information every month about the usage of the tour. So with the functionality of MPEmbed, you can use Google Analytics tags within the tour. So we provide them with a good clear layout so they would know where people are looking from, the kind of numbers, the time, and how long they're spending in the tour, that sort of thing. - Yes, I noticed also there's a lot of annotation within the tour itself. Did you show your client how to do that or did your client provide you the info and you did that? - Yes. So you are correct. The client did want a lot of annotations and they provided us with all that information. So that's sort of part of our ongoing contract with them. So if anything comes up. - So that's part of hosting, support, maintenance- - That's correct. - To, and has there, I imagine there was a flurry to deliver the tour, there was a lot of information going back and forth annotating the space, you deliver it in April, 2024. Are you still annotating? Has there been a request for adding information? - So there hasn't been any requests that I've had to upload in the last few months, but there is something coming up because from time to time, as I mentioned before, it's a 30-year-old complex, so from time to time, there are walls that get repainted or some other machine is taken away or something like that and they want that out of the facilities. So we have something coming up in the next few months. So we're in contact with MPEmbed to ask them about how to substitute 360 photos within the tour without changing the 3D. So yeah, that will make our editing load a lot easier than having to re-annotate the whole scan again just because we added a few new 360 photos or something. - Okay, and just going back to the quote, so I heard, 35 days, the project included 35 days, it included a one year support, maintenance and hosting, or actually, is it within their account, is it within the client's Matterport account or hosted in your Matterport account? - At the moment, it's saved in ours. So we offered them both options but they said that they would prefer it handled at our end because that way, any edits or changes they want made, they can just request by email rather than have to learn how to do the process themselves. Yeah, and they were quite happy with that. - So are there other components of cost? - Components of cost? Okay. So we talked about the actual time scanning, we talked about the editing, and the long-term ongoing contract with them. I guess if you were to sort of make one more component, I would say like the transport to and from the location, those sort of go without saying kind of, like extra costs, yeah. - Travel expenses. I was just wondering if there was some type of overall project fee in addition to this, the scanning days? - No, there isn't. It's just, yes- - That whole, building out the menus, building out 3DVista, the intact scene- - Oh, okay. I sort of included that in editing because as I'm working predominantly on my own, I sort of think working onsite, it's like the scanning itself, working offsite is editing for instance. But I guess- - Ah, okay. So there was an editing fee. - Yeah, that's correct. - Yeah, align average, okay. Daniel, we've covered a lot of ground. We've talked about how the project started. How it was quoted. Understanding what the client's needs. Tools and technology. Problem solving. Workflow. Execution. We've covered multiple technologies, the deliverables with the client. The last thing I wanted to really ask you about is if you were to do this project again and presumably, you actually will, and I don't mean the going back and "okay, that part of the building changed," but this really is a showpiece not only for the Kobe Convention Center, but for your company, Maidansha, I would imagine that you're going to be asked to do similar projects on the scale and the scope. Looking back, are there things that you would say, oh, this is what I would just definitely do differently? - If the tour was far from Osaka and I had to travel back and forth, I definitely would consider getting a Pro3 this time around, next time around because although the client had the time to spend, to push quality this time around, if I was doing this somewhere where I would have to book a hotel for instance, I definitely, from a cost point of view, would consider getting a Pro3, at least to sort of back up, if you know what I mean. the other thing that I would probably do if I was doing this again, is I would likely call on more from my supporting subcontractors so I could focus on other sales work as well to service other clients because one of the things that happened when I was doing this tour was that I spent a lot of time just on this tour, so great for the immediate term, if what I mean. But in the long term, I needed to be keeping my eyes open for jobs to do in three months time and so on like that. So yeah, I definitely would probably, what we call horizontal connections in Japan. So connections with like-minded MSPs are sort of important in that situation. Probably those two things. - I would maybe just ask you about a third. Because you mentioned at the beginning of the show, photogrammetry, could you talk about- - Ah, sure. - Perhaps, if the client had additional time or budget or both, what might that opening shot look like as opposed to the static rotation of the Kobe Convention Center area? - It's good timing that you asked that, actually. Could I share my screen again very briefly? - Yes, yes. - Yeah. So because of time constraints, I'll just show you what is currently loading. Well, actually processing at the moment, you can see at the right bottom, this scan is still being made as such. We actually, it is using AI so it's being trained at the moment. This is far from perfect, but I would love to try something like this with my client's work. It's a little bit rough, the movement is a little bit rough at the moment because it's still being processed, but this is 3D Gaussian Splatting, and I hear that my provider, 3DVista, is now able to use 3D Gaussian Splatting. So we could use something like this maybe at a slightly lower, I guess you'd say, resolution to show our client's exteriors. And this would be something that, well, not a lot of other places are actually able to do at the moment. - Okay. So if you don't mind- - It's far from perfect, but. - I'm going to take it off of screen share and just describe that a little bit. So instead of where in the present world, we moved from wherever the camera was to wherever the camera was. - That's correct. - Somehow your screen is frozen on me, Daniel, so I know you're still there and I can hear you. Just know your screen's frozen. - Okay. - But I, so instead of moving from scan point to scan point, and that's a limitation today, that the Gaussian Splat would enable the complete free-form of moving through the space. And since the scan that you were showing was actually in the midst of the processing and it was, it felt a little bit herky-jerky and slow, in the actual commercial implementation, it would be silky smooth and the ability to fly up or down or around into the Kobe Convention Center in that particular example. So as opposed to having a static image, you could actually move in or move out, move up, move down, and maybe have a little bit more theatrical drama to being able to visit a space, is that sort of what we're talking about? - That's sort of what we're talking about. And I, at this point, because the technology is a little bit difficult to capture on the ground, I would probably focus just on the exterior. But for sure, I'd love to incorporate something like this into a virtual tour. - Awesome, before I move on, before we wind up, is there just anything we haven't talked about you go, oh, but we really should cover? - No, I think we've covered just about everything, but I know as soon as I hang up that all the things will come to mind. - Okay, you can always post in the [www.WeGetAroundNetworkForum.com] I just want to really say for our viewers, particularly Matterport Service Providers that are real estate photographers that are used to documenting homes that are 3,500 square feet tackling a 400,000 square foot project introduces entirely new challenges and complexities, from dealing with large open spaces to managing multiple technologies. I think what Daniel has, his experience has shown, it just really is kind of this invaluable lesson for the WGAN Forum community, for anyone that's looking to expand their business into large commercial projects. Careful what you don't know. You don't know what you don't know, and it's just not a matter of, "oh, well it's 3,500 square feet, this is 400,000 square feet." I'll multiply that out and boom, I'm done. You could get yourself in big trouble if you really are not at this level of skill that you obviously have developed over a number of years. Not just with Matterport, but with many technologies and even new technologies that, like Gaussian Splats that you're looking at. So Daniel, thank you for being back on the show. - Thank you. - We've been visiting with Daniel Brown, president of Maidansha, Inc. (www.Meidansha-co.com) And for Daniel in Osaka, I'm Dan Smigrod, founder of the We Get Around Network Forum and you've been watching WGAN-TV Live at 5. |
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